Open Letter To Management & Fans Re Live Nation Merch Stores Part2

[FooZealand]

So my last thread on this was locked - so I'm left with no chance to add any resolution or any update, I can only post a new thread.

I'd just leave it but given how serious this was for me I just want to put up the facts in one final post. I'm not trying to be angry because they have destroyed anything left to be angry about. On top of the all store shit a lot of effort was put in by Jill (and by me a HUGE amount of time hunting stuff up, writing, making images and explaining) yet still the end result is really only more awful than the start.

1) Jill tried to help. I carefully stated all the facts as brief bullet points in an email.

2) Jill spoke to management, my understanding is they muttered some stuff about the nefarious things people did on the store, that I bought high volumes, and that basically they pretty much felt I was a flipper. And would Jill vouch for me? She rightly said she knew of me but not really all that much about me since she doesn't live on the collector thread (true and totally fair) and could I explain?

3) I sent pics of all my eBay pages showing I haven't sold a thing in over ten years. All my feedback showing the same. My buy page showing me BUYING flipper items. Pics of all my key items showing some of the insane stuff I've acquired that no flipper would ever have.

4) Jill said she truly believed me - she'd already talked to Simon and April. I should hear from someone at management or the store.

5) I heard from nobody.

6) Jill said Management have spoken to the store, management say you won't have any more trouble with your orders and you should contact the store again about your issues.

7) I said I already have THREE outstanding contacts with the store about my issues - I'm not talking to them again, how could there be any point to that? I said if that is all management's response is AFTER having all my information and being able to see the mega fan I am and how bad Im telling them things are, then that is simply just passing the buck, and I am truly shocked because based on the management team I've always known I honestly expected once they found out they would shout "what the shit? - Mike we're sorry - leave it with us we will sort it out..."

But no - management too were utterly silent - not one word, not to me at least. At this point I gave up all hope. I should have known the moment I was even remotely accused of flipping that something has massively changed in management.

8) But wait - 2 days later I get some contact from the store! Yay! right - it will be that missing contact! Nope - their level of concern was just high enough for them to once again partially cancel my last outstanding order. Remember management's: "you will be OK with the store now". So that is management's definition of OK? Fortunately as stated above I have by now already totally given up any hope, so I am just laughing at this final kick in the teeth.

9) I message Jill and tell her all this. I know she has done her very best and really it's just a half hearted sigh on my behalf because I feel I am wasting her time- I even say that. Part of me just wants to not even mail but I figure she should at least know that the store has "helped".

Since then about another week has gone by and there's been no contact from anyone.

So I just wanted to set the record straight. I wanted to thank Jill and lay out the facts. I gave everyone involved a real true chance to fix things, or even at the least to comment and explain, even if they wouldn't apologise. I'm utterly beyond stunned that I was absolutely ignored.

I don't know what happened but it seems the band has now become big enough it either simply no longer wants to, or is no longer able to, truly care about it's fans over making money and creating hype. The posts alone about the store this cycle prove that, without even starting on all the shit I have gone through.

You can say it's management and they don't know about the store - but according to Jill they now DO know. Yet that has made no difference.

That just isn't the support I've shared with the band for 22 years. So I'm saying goodbye. Thanks to everyone who shared stuff with me along the way - and I hope you don't get your heart crushed by this new soul-less machine like I have.

[Johnrougeux]

That sucks.

So are you leaving the forums too? I wouldn't let the store dictate if you stay or go

[matineeidyll]

Just a couple of years ago, they were giving out special keys to the fans who'd been the biggest spenders in the store.

You're justifiably upset - I don't know how I would feel if the folks running the store took over and decided I was a flipper for the crime of spending my money on the band I love. I understand why this feels like a personal and direct kick in the teeth. It would be a total shame, though, to lose you as a fan full-stop over this. There was a reason you began following this band, beyond collecting, beyond the many merch contract changes that have happened in the last few years, let alone of all time. There's a reason you do it beyond any expectations of recognition as a 'mega-fan'. Now, the problems with LN have been apparent from the start, are affecting more than merch, and are prompting more than a few fans to speak up. But with the exception of yourself, the love for the band hasn't changed - it can be recognized as a very particular issue aside from that, one that's removed from FF's personal meaning to them.

Management took it seriously enough to speak to the store. The store's own response is lame even after being made aware of it, but although you still feel slighted, they did try to help, which is more than what most get. To be blunt, no, they're probably not going to treat you any more differently than that, compared to the next fan, and it seems like that's what you wanted after everything you've invested.

Try to step outside your emotions for a moment and identify the source of the grief. From how you've described what's been going on, I don't think it's the band themselves, and being upset with them as the figureheads is only an easy way to remove yourself from it. I go back to what I said near the start - remember why you got into this.

[aprilshack]

Originally Posted by FooZealand

So my last thread on this was locked - so I'm left with no chance to add any resolution or any update, I can only post a new thread.

I'd just leave it but given how serious this was for me I just want to put up the facts in one final post. I'm not trying to be angry because they have destroyed anything left to be angry about. On top of the all store shit a lot of effort was put in by Jill (and by me a HUGE amount of time hunting stuff up, writing, making images and explaining) yet still the end result is really only more awful than the start.

1) Jill tried to help. I carefully stated all the facts as brief bullet points in an email.

2) Jill spoke to management, my understanding is they muttered some stuff about the nefarious things people did on the store, that I bought high volumes, and that basically they pretty much felt I was a flipper. And would Jill vouch for me? She rightly said she knew of me but not really all that much about me since she doesn't live on the collector thread (true and totally fair) and could I explain?

3) I sent pics of all my eBay pages showing I haven't sold a thing in over ten years. All my feedback showing the same. My buy page showing me BUYING flipper items. Pics of all my key items showing some of the insane stuff I've acquired that no flipper would ever have.

4) Jill said she truly believed me - she'd already talked to Simon and April. I should hear from someone at management or the store.

5) I heard from nobody.

6) Jill said Management have spoken to the store, management say you won't have any more trouble with your orders and you should contact the store again about your issues.

7) I said I already have THREE outstanding contacts with the store about my issues - I'm not talking to them again, how could there be any point to that? I said if that is all management's response is AFTER having all my information and being able to see the mega fan I am and how bad Im telling them things are, then that is simply just passing the buck, and I am truly shocked because based on the management team I've always known I honestly expected once they found out they would shout "what the shit? - Mike we're sorry - leave it with us we will sort it out..."

But no - management too were utterly silent - not one word, not to me at least. At this point I gave up all hope. I should have known the moment I was even remotely accused of flipping that something has massively changed in management.

8) But wait - 2 days later I get some contact from the store! Yay! right - it will be that missing contact! Nope - their level of concern was just high enough for them to once again partially cancel my last outstanding order. Remember management's: "you will be OK with the store now". So that is management's definition of OK? Fortunately as stated above I have by now already totally given up any hope, so I am just laughing at this final kick in the teeth.

9) I message Jill and tell her all this. I know she has done her very best and really it's just a half hearted sigh on my behalf because I feel I am wasting her time- I even say that. Part of me just wants to not even mail but I figure she should at least know that the store has "helped".

Since then about another week has gone by and there's been no contact from anyone.

So I just wanted to set the record straight. I wanted to thank Jill and lay out the facts. I gave everyone involved a real true chance to fix things, or even at the least to comment and explain, even if they wouldn't apologise. I'm utterly beyond stunned that I was absolutely ignored.

I don't know what happened but it seems the band has now become big enough it either simply no longer wants to, or is no longer able to, truly care about it's fans over making money and creating hype. The posts alone about the store this cycle prove that, without even starting on all the shit I have gone through.

You can say it's management and they don't know about the store - but according to Jill they now DO know. Yet that has made no difference.

That just isn't the support I've shared with the band for 22 years. So I'm saying goodbye. Thanks to everyone who shared stuff with me along the way - and I hope you don't get your heart crushed by this new soul-less machine like I have.

Jill reached out to me asking what you do with your stuff and i said you are just a major collector. I find it hard to believe that they don't think there are major collectors of foo merch out there. Just don't give the official store your money anymore? There are other online stores with foo stuff with better customer service out there. I don't blame you for how you feel but it would be a shame to not come on here anymore with the online friendships you have cultivated over the years.

[Let It Die]

Count me as one that hopes you don't leave because of Live Nation and their incompetence. You are one of the most knowledgeable (if not the most knowledgeable) Foo Fighters' collectors on here. You, I, April and others buy a lot of stuff from their stores (US, UK, AU). For their first thought to be that you're a flipper is pathetic. Hell, if they thought people were flipping stuff, then mark it up. That's what keeps a flipper out of business.

I've dealt with them many times since they handle a number of band's merch and their customer service is one of the worst. It's hit & miss whether you'll get your stuff or anything resolved with them in my experience. They're the largest concert promoter who now owns Ticketmaster. That should tell you all you need to know. Yet another awful & incompetent company when it comes to customer service. So, you have the largest concert promoter who owns the largest ticket distributor and they both suck at customer service.

I wish the Foos would look at how Pearl Jam handles their fans. They are now at this point where they are as big of a band. PJ has a fan club with a modest fee every year and fantastic customer service. You usually get great seats because they give first dibs to their fan club members and they give fan club members first dibs on any exclusive merch. So, not only do you get great seats at the shows, you also get a shot at the merch online that the flippers try and all buy up at the shows.

[Chicago]

Add me to the list of people who hopes you don't leave the forum because of this. I've learned so much from you over the years.
Don't let people who work for Live Nation merch leave a bad taste in your mouth.

[FooZealand]

Thank you everyone

I've spent a few days seriously considering throwing it in. Truly.

But it's not the band. Even IF management are at all at fault that's not the band. What management can do with LN who really knows. Maybe it's less than I think.

When I say "mega fan" that's only in terms of money - nobody is really a bigger fan than any other and I know that - every purchase should be treated the same and there are all kinds of shitty things going on with reselling merch and tickets and I totally support all efforts to limit things so the real fans get what the band offers.

Anyway you all make many good points about why we are all really here and I know I have at least some value along the way - and to just remove that from everyone would really only end up hurting me more than this shit.

I've talked a lot over the years about the karma I've had with the band. For me that's all been in collecting - others get it in meeting the guys and getting into gigs etc. I spend a good amount of time looking at stuff, but honestly it's not as much as some people probably think - crazy shit just lands in my lap most of the time.

Last night I was talking (in person) to someone I know well. He's been to two Foo gigs - once with me - likes them OK but a huge Metallica fan. He sums up his argument by saying "Don't be a dick Mike - you know you can't stop now and how much of your most important stuff ever came from the store anyway?"

I knew he was right - I could just dial it back and let things happen however they are meant to, maybe including the store a bit if needed. Avoid some of the stress that the BS has loaded on the good shit recently.

Felt a lot better last night after that - even with a hangover

And then in true Foo karma fashion I see this today. Granted at least April saw it sooner than me but others that I know (and have talked to) would have bought, but didn't as they hadn't seen it. And maybe that's the real point - everything with this band happens for a reason.

http://forum.foofighters.com/showthread.php?t=171619

I want to thank Jill again for her support - you do a great job on the board stepping in when needed (including a few times @ me when I've lost my temper over the years), but your emails have shown me a lot more about how much you really care. That's been a nice takeaway from all the crap as well.

Mods we can close this one if you want - and thanks guys - all your comments did help this old flipper

[lharris92]

I always enjoy seeing you with those rarities that I can never seem to find on fleabay

[aprilshack]

Originally Posted by lharris92

I always enjoy seeing you with those rarities that I can never seem to find on fleabay

I really don’t know how he finds them considering I have a lot of saved searches on eBay and they don’t come up but Mike ends up buying them!

[lharris92]

Originally Posted by aprilshack

I really don’t know how he finds them considering I have a lot of saved searches on eBay and they don’t come up but Mike ends up buying them!

To be fair I have loads of searches, its just making sure to check them regularly.

[sandsotime2]

Originally Posted by aprilshack

Jill reached out to me asking what you do with your stuff and i said you are just a major collector. I find it hard to believe that they don't think there are major collectors of foo merch out there. Just don't give the official store your money anymore? There are other online stores with foo stuff with better customer service out there. I don't blame you for how you feel but it would be a shame to not come on here anymore with the online friendships you have cultivated over the years.

Agreed. I said it in the first thread, there are so many moving pieces please don't assume no one cares. I own a vintage market and I can't tell you the fuckups that can happen and we are talking about 1/100th of the people. I know sometimes people can think, how could that even happen? (something we did) and the answer is, it does. We never want to hurt anyone. I've also noticed, when there is a problem, we usually screw up some more, like when it rains it pours on that one particular person. It sadly happens.

[Jill]

Happy to help when I can.

Management really does care. I know it’s difficult to see but in the sea of promotional stuff going on right now with the band and tours and presales, inot to mention their other clients they did make the call and send emails. I saw them.

Glad you’re sticking around.